Are Catholics Christ?

[Ayodhya Nath Bhat]

Are Catholics Christ?


"Let us rejoice then and give thanks that we have become not only Christians, but Christ himself. Marvel and rejoice: we have become Christ."

Wow! Notice that Catholics are not merely Christians, they have become "Christ himself."

"My church cannot possibly teach this," Catholics often argue. But two additional catechism quotes further prove this is official Catholic doctrine.

"For the Son of man became man so that we might become God."

"The only-begotten Son of God, wanting to make us sharers in his divinity, assumed our nature, so that he, made man, might make men gods."


Even nominal Catholics know this is utter nonsense. So the million dollar question is, "What are these quotes doing in the book of official Roman Catholic doctrine?

According to Jesus Christ, all who claim to be Christ are deceivers:

"For many shall come in my name, saying, I am Christ; and shall deceive many." Matthew 24:5

Jesus warned about being taken in by these deceivers:

"Take heed that ye be not deceived: for many shall come in my name, saying, I am Christ…" Luke 21:8

"Then if any man shall say unto you, Lo, here is Christ, or there; believe it not." Matthew 24:23


Yet the question remains. If the Catholic church does not believe this, then why are these quotes in the catechism?

Many Catholics have written me, asking "How could you write such a thing? We don't believe that." But I did not write the catechism. I only quoted it. And they never answer the question, "If your religion does not believe these doctrines, why are they in your book of official doctrine?"

Some Catholics accuse me of twisting the words. If you feel this way, please go back and read the quotes again. They are direct, easy-to-understand statements. It is impossible to twist them. So the question remains, "Why are the quotes there?"

At least false cults like Mormonism and occultic New Agers admit teaching this unbiblical doctrine. They completely reject Bible verses like:

"… I am God, and there is none else; I am God, and there is none like me," Isaiah 46:9

Roman Catholicism also rejects such verses, for there is only one answer to the question at hand. These quotes appear in the catechism for one simple reason… because they are official Roman Catholic doctrine.


The ultimate insult

Throughout this book, you have seen how Catholic doctrines steal honor and glory due to Jesus Christ and give it to Mary, popes, wafers, saints, statues, etc. But this is the ultimate insult.

The Creator of the universe, the King of kings and Lord of lords, has been dethroned and declared no better than any Catholic on the street.

Where could such an ungodly doctrine come from? Remember how Satan boasted that he would exalt his throne "above the stars of God" (Isaiah 14:13)? This same Satan declared "I will be like the most High" (Isaiah 14:14). The devil has always longed to be like God. Is this doctrine a clue as to the real father of Roman Catholicism?

Was it not Satan who deceived Adam and Eve, promising they would be "as gods" if they ate of the forbidden fruit (Genesis 3:5)?

Is Satan still using this same lie to deceive Roman Catholics, promising you that, simply by being a Catholic, you can become God Himself?

You should be outraged that an official Catholic doctrine reflects the desires and goals of Satan, and rejects the teachings of God's Word.


Conclusion

Here is the next question you must answer: "Am I willing to remain in a church that openly teaches outright satanic heresy?"

"But to us there is but one God, the Father, of whom are all things, and we in him; and one Lord Jesus Christ, by whom are all things, and we by him." 1 Corinthians 8:6


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

[Seeker]

Ayodhya,

You ask a very good question and I would like try to do justice to it.  Would you provide the page number or paragraph number of these quotes in the Catechism so I can look them up?  I think I know the context of these items, but want to make sure.  Thanks.

God Bless.

[Seeker]

I think I found one paragraph you quoted.  Here is the full text out of the catechism.

795 Christ and his Church thus together make up the "whole Christ" (Christus totus). The Church is one with Christ. The saints are acutely aware of this unity:

Let us rejoice then and give thanks that we have become not only Christians, but Christ himself. Do you understand and grasp, brethren, God's grace toward us? Marvel and rejoice: we have become Christ. For if he is the head, we are the members; he and we together are the whole man. . . . The fullness of Christ then is the head and the members. But what does "head and members" mean? Christ and the Church.
Our redeemer has shown himself to be one person with the holy Church whom he has taken to himself.

Head and members form as it were one and the same mystical person.

A reply of St. Joan of Arc to her judges sums up the faith of the holy doctors and the good sense of the believer: "About Jesus Christ and the Church, I simply know they're just one thing, and we shouldn't complicate the matter."

[Ayodhya Nath Bhat]

Are Catholics Christ?


"Let us rejoice then and give thanks that we have become not only Christians, but Christ himself. Marvel and rejoice: we have become Christ." Pg. 210, #795

Wow! Notice that Catholics are not merely Christians, they have become "Christ himself."

"My church cannot possibly teach this," Catholics often argue. But two additional catechism quotes further prove this is official Catholic doctrine.

"For the Son of man became man so that we might become God." Pg. 116, #460

"The only-begotten Son of God, wanting to make us sharers in his divinity, assumed our nature, so that he, made man, might make men gods." Pg. 116, #460

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

[Seeker]

Thanks!

[Rev. Eric]

Hello Ayodhya,

First I would like to sincerely applaud you for quoting the Catechism of the Catholic Church.  It shows that you desire to converse with Catholics according to what our Church officially teaches.  I wish everyone would do the same.

Not everything in the Catechism, however, is an official doctrine.  It also contains opinion and theological speculation, although it is not always clear how to distinquish between these.

It also contains commentary on scripture, which is what you have uncovered.

The Catechism texts that you are quoting are simply elaborations on 1Pet 1:3-4 (that Christians become "partakers of the divine nature") as well as elaborations on how Christians are one in the body of Christ.  This union with Christ is realized on earth but perfected in heaven.

God spoke to the Psalmist:  "I say, 'You are gods, sons of the Most High, all of you; nevertheless, you shall die like men, and fall like any prince'."  (Ps 82:6)

We are made in the image and likeness of God and are destined for eternal life in Him.  So in that sense, humans are "gods", symbolically speaking.  Yet, without the saving power of Christ we are condemned to death, not only in this earthly life, but in the "second death," which is hell.  But through Christ humanity is redeemed and we are brought into union with Him, to partake in the divine life He shares with the Father and Holy Spirit.  Going back to the quote from Psalm 82, we become, through Christ, the "gods" that God created us to be.

This does not mean that a Christian becomes an eternal divine person wielding the powers of creation.  Any divinity we have comes by sharing in Christ, who has perfectly united divinity and humanity in Himself.

One of the duties of the Catechism is to try to explain many aspects of Christianity which, ultimately, are mysteries.  Part of the Profession of Faith is that Christ is the Head of His body, the Church (Col 1:18) and that He became flesh to make us partakers of His divine nature (1Pet 1:3-4).  The Catechism is a teaching tool.  It is not enough for it to have us recite these scripture passages and move on.  It has to attempt to explain exactly what these passages mean in terms of our own lives.

In an attempt to explain this, the Catechism turned to biblical commentaries penned by St. Augustine, St. Iraneus, St. Athanasius and St. Thomas Aquinas.  These are the people that you quoted in your post, and the Catechism clearly footnoted them.  What you have here are the theological speculations of certain saints.  Although Catholics believe that they were gifted theologians and very holy people, they were not writing as members of the Magsterium, which is the official teaching office of the Church.  In essence, all those quotes that you found so disturbing can be categorized as the opinions of certain men.

Obviously you find the Catechism's explanations of these passages (and the quotations from the saints) as having gone too far.  Personally, I have no problem with them in light of my understanding of all this (as I have presented above).  But the task remains for the Catechism to give Catholics some kind of explanation of these biblical passages.  Because we are dealing with the mysteries of the Christian Faith, no explanation will ever be perfect.  And yet the task remains to try.

You might ponder what you, personally, would write if you were given this task.  Chances are, somebody out there would say that your explanations either went too far while others would say that they did not go far enough.  You might even have people accusing you of "outright satanic heresy."  

But take comfort in knowing that Catholics do not read the Catechism and think that we are "God" in the manner that you interpreted in your post.

God bless,
-Rev. Eric

[Rev. Eric]

P.S.

Ayodhya, I wanted to comment on your statement: Throughout this book, you have seen how Catholic doctrines steal honor and glory due to Jesus Christ and give it to Mary, popes, wafers, saints, statues, etc. separately, so I will do so in this P.S.

I readily understand that you do not believe many of the things that Catholics do, but I think it would help if you understood our position on them, even if you disagree with these beliefs.

Catholic Doctrines
We believe that official Church doctrine and dogma is revealed to us by God, just as the bible is revealed by God.

Wafers
We believe that during the Mass, the wafers become Christ and everything that Christ is, His Body, Blood, Soul and Divinty.  To us, they cease being wafers and are Christ in the Eucharist.  As such, the honor we give to the Eucharist is honor given to Christ.

Popes
We honor popes because we believe that they are the official head of the Church on earth, an authority given to them by Christ.

Statues
We do not honor the statue, but the person the statue represents.  We also respect the blessing that may have been put upon a statue, as it means that this object has been set aside for holy use.  In terms of whether or not we should honor persons, such as Mary, the saints, etc., I will now address that:

Mary (& saints)
Within the lives of Mary and the saints we see holiness and goodness.  Obviously, all holiness and goodness comes from God.  Therefore, when we honor Mary and the saints, we honor the power of Christ which worked so strongly in them, and continues to work in them now in heaven.  We believe that there are a variety of ways to honor God.  We give honor directly to God, which is called "latria", the honor due to God alone, and the just honor a creature owes his creator.

But we can also honor God through his saints, because we honor His power working in them.  Nevertheless, we do not call this type of honor "latria" because there is still a human component to these saints.  They were humans who participated in God's power.  So we honor the power of God in the saints and the willingness of the saints to say "yes" to God and strive to do His will.  Because we are not directly honoring God in the saints, we call this type of honor "dulia."  This is the honor that may be given to a creature.  For example, we are called to honor our fathers and mothers, and that kind of honor would be dulia.

We believe that Mary, being the one through whom Christ came into the world, played a unique role in God's plan of salvation.  We award her a special type of honor called "hyper-dulia" which simply means "beyond dulia," but it is still below that of "latria."  Furthermore I could argue that Jesus himself gave Mary perfect honor, because to say otherwise would be to say that Jesus did not perfectly follow one of the 10 Commandments.  This does not mean that Mary is better than Jesus, but this does mean that she is to be honored, for an imitator of Christ would do as He did.

And in a world full of corruption it is fitting to honor those who dedicated themselves to God.  Society readily honors people like Abraham Lincoln and George Washington for their contributions to the nation, and we fashion statues of them to remind each generation of them and the role models that they are.  Catholics do the same thing with Mary and the saints.

So this is what Catholics have in mind when we say that we give honor to these various things.  Nevertheless, there are those who call us idolaters, even though we are practicing our Christian Faith in exactly the way that we feel God wants us to.

But this, apparently, is lost on people like Rogelio Rodriguez.  On Jan. 13th he arrived at the Cathedral of San Antonio and informed the Catholics there that they were "idolaters" and yelled that he was there to "save them."  Before he could be arrested he vandalized the church and smashed seven statues (six of which were over 100 years old).  The current damage estimate exceeds $200,000.

Well, I need to sign off here so I can get ready for Mass.

God bless,
-Rev. Eric

[Seeker]

Rev. Eric,
I learned a lot from your reply to Ayodhya.  I'm glad you take time out of your busy schedule to do this.

[Ayodhya Nath Bhat]

Thanks all of you for your responses.

A N Bhat

[DavidFilmer]

If Ayodhya plans to cut-and-paste the works of others, the least he could do is attribute it. Ayodhya plagerized this content from the book "Understanding Roman Catholicism," copyright 1995 by Rick Jones, which is posted (with permission and attrition) on Jack Chick's website (Jack Chick is a professional anti-Catholic):

http://www.chick.com/reading/books/160/160%5F33.asp